From lee at designkiln.com  Mon Feb  9 17:39:45 2009
From: lee at designkiln.com (Lee Joramo)
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 09:39:45 -0700
Subject: [Kss-devel] Pre-caching images
Message-ID: <7AD4D901-D489-46AD-88FB-CC785346FE54@designkiln.com>

I have setup a small KSS that swaps images when you mouse over anchor  
tags. This works fine on the fast local network, but I need to pre- 
cache the images some how for it to work  on the live server. How can  
I get KSS to pre-cache images?

To see the example I am working on hover over the various Pledge Level  
links at:

http://kafm.designkiln.com/#pledgeNow


Below are a slightly simplified version of my HTML and KSS:

Many Thanks

-- 
Lee Joramo
	/ designKiln.com
	/ 970.261.8426



HTML:

<img id="#myImage" src="/images/1.jpg" />
<a id="link1" href="page1">Page 1</a>
<a id="link2" href="page1">Page 2</a>
<a id="link3" href="page1">Page 3</a>


KSS:

#link1:mouseover {
     action-client: setAttribute;
     setAttribute-kssSelector: "#myImage";
     setAttribute-name: "src";
     setAttribute-value: "/images/1.jpg";
}
#link2:mouseover {
     action-client: setAttribute;
     setAttribute-kssSelector: "#myImage";
     setAttribute-name: "src";
     setAttribute-value: "/images/2.jpg";
}
#link3:mouseover {
     action-client: setAttribute;
     setAttribute-kssSelector: "#myImage";
     setAttribute-name: "src";
     setAttribute-value: "/images/3.jpg";
}

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From gotcha at bubblenet.be  Mon Feb  9 18:09:47 2009
From: gotcha at bubblenet.be (Godefroid Chapelle)
Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 18:09:47 +0100
Subject: [Kss-devel] Pre-caching images
In-Reply-To: <7AD4D901-D489-46AD-88FB-CC785346FE54@designkiln.com>
References: <7AD4D901-D489-46AD-88FB-CC785346FE54@designkiln.com>
Message-ID: <4990635B.9080502@bubblenet.be>

Lee Joramo wrote:
> I have setup a small KSS that swaps images when you mouse over anchor 
> tags. This works fine on the fast local network, but I need to pre-cache 
> the images some how for it to work  on the live server. How can I get 
> KSS to pre-cache images?
> 
> To see the example I am working on hover over the various Pledge Level 
> links at:
> 
> http://kafm.designkiln.com/#pledgeNow
> 
> 
> Below are a slightly simplified version of my HTML and KSS:
> 
> Many Thanks
> 
> -- 
> Lee Joramo 
> / designKiln.com 
> / 970.261.8426
> 
> 
> 
> HTML:
> 
> <img id="#myImage" src="/images/1.jpg" />
> <a id="link1" href="page1">Page 1</a>
> <a id="link2" href="page1">Page 2</a>
> <a id="link3" href="page1">Page 3</a>
> 
> 
> KSS:
> 
> #link1:mouseover {
>     action-client: setAttribute;
>     setAttribute-kssSelector: "#myImage";
>     setAttribute-name: "src";
>     setAttribute-value: "/images/1.jpg";
> }
> #link2:mouseover {
>     action-client: setAttribute;
>     setAttribute-kssSelector: "#myImage";
>     setAttribute-name: "src";
>     setAttribute-value: "/images/2.jpg";
> }
> #link3:mouseover {
>     action-client: setAttribute;
>     setAttribute-kssSelector: "#myImage";
>     setAttribute-name: "src";
>     setAttribute-value: "/images/3.jpg";
> }
> 
> 
In your case, I would not use a img tag. I would use a div tag, and use 
css to specify size and background image.

That background image would actually be composed of sprites (iow a 
single image that includes your images). KSS would then only specify he 
background offset instead of changing the source.

HTH

-- 
Godefroid Chapelle (aka __gotcha) http://bubblenet.be

From ree at ree.hu  Wed Feb 11 07:36:24 2009
From: ree at ree.hu (Balazs Ree)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 07:36:24 +0100
Subject: [Kss-devel] FireBug 1.3.2 works now with kss?
Message-ID: <pan.2009.02.11.06.35.43@ree.hu>

Hi!

We had problems with kss running on FF3 when FireBug 1.3 is installed. It 
seems these problems are gone, when upgrading to FireBug 1.3.2.

If you can, please test this: install or upgrade FireBug to 1.3.2 and see 
if you experience any issues with kss?

p.s. FireKiss still needs an update to work with FireBug 1.3.2, so please 
try without FireKiss for the time. 

Best wishes,


-- 
Balazs Ree


From lee at designkiln.com  Wed Feb 11 21:59:28 2009
From: lee at designkiln.com (Lee Joramo)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 13:59:28 -0700
Subject: [Kss-devel] Pre-caching images
In-Reply-To: <4990635B.9080502@bubblenet.be>
References: <7AD4D901-D489-46AD-88FB-CC785346FE54@designkiln.com>
	<4990635B.9080502@bubblenet.be>
Message-ID: <63748AFE-274A-4AF2-A64B-0D718B3075B9@designkiln.com>

Thanks,

Our right, css sprites did the trick nicely

Thanks


--  
Lee Joramo
	/ designKiln.com
	/ 970.261.8426


>
> In your case, I would not use a img tag. I would use a div tag, and  
> use css to specify size and background image.
>
> That background image would actually be composed of sprites (iow a  
> single image that includes your images). KSS would then only specify  
> he background offset instead of changing the source.
>
> HTH
>
> -- 
> Godefroid Chapelle (aka __gotcha) http://bubblenet.be


From ree at ree.hu  Sat Feb 21 09:04:25 2009
From: ree at ree.hu (Balazs Ree)
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 09:04:25 +0100
Subject: [Kss-devel] Can KSS help in my use case ?
References: <19C0F851463E4952A89215D7D6B95256@DELLGIOVANNI>
	<4308f0ba0902191901t4d2cdd59kcb1345d18d5ebd42@mail.gmail.com>
	<7DA79654A7F24894B8EDDD96F5B947DB@DELLGIOVANNI>
	<4308f0ba0902201047h6f897375xb60ffefb8eef5dfd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <pan.2009.02.21.08.03.23@ree.hu>

On Fri, 20 Feb 2009 12:47:07 -0600, Nathan Van Gheem wrote:


>> But I was wandering whether using KSS would make the whole more clean,
>> readable and maintainable.
>>
> I suppose it might be a little more clean and readable.  I think you can
> make non-kss code very clean and readable though too.
> 
> I can't speak for all the Plone developers out there, but it seems there
> is a growing concern that kss isn't the way to go anymore.  It is too
> heavy(lots of extra code for the browser to download and parse).  IMO,
> kss became cumbersome to do easy tasks that were just a bit outside its
> capabilities and I'm no longer going to use it anymore.  In your use
> case it might work though.

Kss aims to focus on supporting the following developer roles (with 
increasing order of knowledge and expertise needed):

- developer or designer that wires up a page via a kss stylesheet

- developer who develops and sets up an ajax application, by a kss 
  stylesheet and server side kss actions (python)

- developer who creates a plugin for kss (in javascript) making it
  available for use to the above groups. This is needed for kss to 
  provide fat client behaviour for several use cases such as drag and
  drop or custom javascript widgets.

We had moderate success to document the first two activities, but we 
never arrived to documenting the third one: the making of kss plugins in 
a simple and accessible way. Those of us who actually wrote kss plugins, 
also realized that kss lacks some wisdom in this area. During the lessons 
we learned from encountered use cases and projects, some of us also 
realized that we need to improve the plugin creation process a great 
deal. One specific goal is to make plugin creation more accessible for 
javascript developers and inline with the accustomed js development 
techniques (while keeping the rest of the kss backwards compatible).

Before this happens I can give the following advice on deciding about 
whether or not deploying kss in a project:

- If you don't actually need to have a fat client or write actual 
javascript code, you can use kss to implement your ajax in the documented 
way, with all benefits offered.

- If you need a fat client, just go ahead and implement your features in
javascript "as usual". If you want you can also have some kss code 
running in parallel with your javascript: although kss won't know about 
your additional javascript in this case, but it also will peacefully 
coexist with it.

- If you already have your extra javascript running, you would have a 
chance to make it into a kss plugin: write a wrapper that enables using 
your new code from within kss. This allows you to wire up and configure 
your new features from kss, and provide the same code as a kss plugin 
egg, reusable in other applications without touching the javascript.

Since the last step and process involved is the undocumented one that I 
mentioned above, I would only suggest to attempt it if you have deep 
knowledge about both javascript and understand bits of the kss internals. 
In particular I would not suggest to dig into "kss event creation", 
however for simple cases it is easy to create just "kss actions" (and for 
this you will also find some documentation and examples).


I would also like to react a bit about performance. We believe there is a 
lot we can improve here, one of my personal development plans is called 
"zerotolerance": and it aims to implement **0 pageload overhead** in kss. 
(Yes we figured out a feasible way to do that.)

So, although we cannot promise an immediate remedy to the above stated 
problems, development of kss is going on with some exciting goals to 
reach by the end of 2009. 

Best wishes,

-- 
Balazs Ree